a summary of moffat’s writing:
- it’s the doctor’s darkest hour
- no this is the doctor’s REAL darkest hour
- no no hear me out guys this is the doctor’s darkest hour FOR REAL THIS TIME I SWEAR
- look i know i said the last one was but THIS IS THE DOCTOR’S DARKEST HOUR
- ＴＨＥ ＤＯＣＴＯＲ＇Ｓ ＤＡＲＫＥＳＴ ＨＯＵＲ
genderbutt replied to your post:i have come to realize one of the (many) things i…I’m not sure only having watched/preferring New Who is considered so bad when so many of us (who are too young/not British enough to have watched Old Who back in the day) got into Doctor Who because of New Who
i guess the logic is that a Real Fan would want to watch/read/listen to every single episode/audio/comic/obscure 90s EU novel they could get their hands on, so if you just stopped with new Who you obviously aren’t a “real fan”
i find it especially … ignorant? embarassing? that so often what these types of posts about “nuvians” are doing is blaming people for… having read the text more or less correctly. like, the “typical nuvian” opinions they complain about are very much the opinions New Who itself has been encouraging you to have — the doctor as hero, doctor/rose and doctor/river as romantic relationships, the doctor not liking guns, the doctor as peacekeeper and pacifist, etc. “ha ha!!! you watched this show and you came away with the obvious intended interpretation it was pushing!!! you’re… so stupid…??” it’s like making fun of people who read harry potter for thinking harry is the chosen one.
(whether or not classic who even contradicts some of those ideals is another argument in itself, but i still think it’s irrelevant to the issue of like… criticizing new who fans for knowing and understanding the specific thing you are saying they are a fan of.)
also, re: your point in (…): most often I find these arguments rather intellectually dishonest when it comes to proving that Classic Who was so much more X than New Who. like when you complain about Twelve’s ~Trip Into Darkness~ (lol) you get some smug comments like “well, in the very first story…” casually ignoring 50 years of storytelling and character development. a lot of ~telling the new kids how Classic Who really is~ consists of wilfully misleading nonsense and exaggerations of obscure plot points that have no meaning in the broader scope of things.
lbr here this sort of behaviour is just plain gate-keeping and segregating the fanbase into ~true fans~ and ~fake geek( girl)s~ (I don’t think male New Who fans get as much shit as female fans or at least not in those sweeping accusations of “you only watch it for Ten/Eleven cause they’re hot”). it’s quite funny when the same ppl are often lamenting that not more New Who fans are interested in Classic Who - but srsly what do they expect when they present the show as this dark and edgy Doctor going on adventures with 2-dimentional sidekicks. who the hell would be interested in that??
and I say all of this as someone who watched Classic Who and really liked it, and who knows other New Who fans who had the same experience. I think Classic Who can be a lot of fun for New Who fans if you can get used to the old story format. but at the same time I’m just so frustrated with certain parts of the Classic Who fandom who somehow manage to come up with the worst sales pitches and then are smug asses when ppl don’t want to watch the old stuff.
ugh, sorry for rambling
yeah it really is straight-up gatekeeping. i mean, like i said in my original post, despite the amount of classic who and big finish i’ve now watched/listened to, i’m still basically the textbook definition of dirty “nuvian” for most of these people, so clearly the term has pretty much nothing to do with your knowledge of classic who and everything to do with not liking the right things. which, pf, yawn.
and totally re: disingenuous presentation of events in classic who. usually it’s stuff to carry on this lie about the doctor ~not being a hero~ because obviously a show about an edgy antihero villain who smashes people’s heads with rocks is totes way cooler than the reality that you are watching a family show about a magical guy who saves the day with his friends.
and i’ve talked before about the paradoxical “why won’t anyone watch classic who”/”classic who is sOOOOooOO different hahaha stupid nuvians don’t know what they’re in for” sales pitch so many people in classic who fandom have. it’s so bizarre. the way to encourage people to watch the thing you like is not to ridicule them for not having already seen it, nor is it to say “that thing you really like? well this is NOTHING LIKE THAT IT’S SO MUCH BETTER HAHAHA WATCH IT AND SEE HOW WHAT YOU LIKE SUCKS”. pretty sure more so-called nuvians will be interested in classic stuff if you tell them how it ties into or sets up or is similar to new who, than if you tell them watching it will prove all the ways new who sucks.
This attitude has been around since 2005 even, so way back when, I decided to try to watch as much Classic Who as possible. I wound up watching around 70% of the old episodes/serials, making LJ posts on everything. (Proof, man. PROOF.)
And after having watched the holy records I can officially say WHAT THE FUCKING HELL ARE YOU CLASSIC WHO PEOPLE TALKING ABOUT?? Now, I get the love for it - the nostalgia, the innocence, the bubble wrap monsters, and even a pretty decent story or three. But the stuff some people claim about Classic Who? lol no. Especially the “superiority” of it. It’s sort of like trying to claim that the 1978 Avengers > > 2012 Avengers because of REASONS. When those reasons basically boil down to childhood nostalgia.